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I doubt anyone in a toy-focussed fandom is really unfamiliar with army builders... It's more that, with a few exceptions, it's not really been a thing in TF the way it has in other fandoms (the thing with Stormtroopers is that canonically there really are countless identical white-armoured soldiers in the Empire, and they're Our Heroes' most frequent on-screen opponents; TF is much more about individual characters). Sure, if you go looking, there are Vehicons in Prime, G2 Decepticons, Autotroopers, Insecticons and so on, but they're not generally the focus. Prime's probably the exception here in its 'video-game-y' way of throwing loads of generic enemies at the protagonists rather than having the 'heroes' of each faction duke it out every episode.AllNewSuperRobot wrote:This is interesting to me.
Firstly, because yours is the second instance I've seen. That seems unfamiliar with the army builder concept. Also how popular it is...
Psychout wrote:Im not scared of a gender confused minibot!
Glyph wrote: Prime's probably the exception here in its 'video-game-y' way of throwing loads of generic enemies at the protagonists rather than having the 'heroes' of each faction duke it out every episode.
Glyph wrote: but I don't believe they make up a sizeable proportion of TF collectors, much less the mass market.
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Ahem...
Beast Machines. Home to the original Vehicon drone army...
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:The original three Seekers, the Coneheads, Prowl, Smokescreen, Bluestreak {...snip...}Glyph wrote: but I don't believe they make up a sizeable proportion of TF collectors, much less the mass market.
Most of the Transformers line is redecos/retools. The Exceptions are the standalone designs. They don't just make up a sizable part of any TF collection. But the franchise itself.
Psychout wrote:Im not scared of a gender confused minibot!
Glyph wrote:AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Ahem...
Beast Machines. Home to the original Vehicon drone army...Of course the BM Vehicons. That's what I get for writing too late at night.
Glyph wrote: No, I was talking about people who collect army builder figures, not the figures themselves. There are obviously tons of repaints and retools out there (strictly the majority of the franchise? I'm not actually sure and that would be an interesting survey to do, but TFs are way more complex than typical action figures so gotta make that tooling stretch as far as it can). But note that nearly all those redecos are named individual characters, not what I understand 'army builders' to mean.
TFWiki wrote:Army-building (also troop-building) is a nickname for a toy-collecting habit that involves buying multiple identical toys which represent generic or mass-produced characters
Psychout wrote:Im not scared of a gender confused minibot!
Glyph wrote: the question was about how many variant copies of the same figure you could get away with in a line without killing its marketability.
Glyph wrote: just that it's not what TF lore focusses on,
Glyph wrote:BW Megs and Trypticon don't look anything like each other!
RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:Don't know why Optimus can't keep his flat nose forever. I figure, if someone thinks a more common semi setup is in order, make the front piece a parts forming weapon, backpack or something.
ZeroWolf wrote:You can only cater to nostalgia for so long before stagnation sets in.
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:ZeroWolf wrote:You can only cater to nostalgia for so long before stagnation sets in.
Exactly. I'll point to the best example of that: TMNT. For a line that has the same principle four characters. They have never to my knowledge, gone backwards. Sure Neca and Super7 released figures to cater to the 80's toyline/cartoon. But TMNT media hasn't.
As a brand, Hasbro tends to forget "new" has a proven track record in Transformers. They just need to shift more "80's/G1 fans" out of the decision making process.
RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:But what is so special about Optimus if he looks like literally every other truck out there?
RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:But what is so special about Optimus if he looks like literally every other truck out there?
D-Maximal_Primal wrote:RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:But what is so special about Optimus if he looks like literally every other truck out there?
Who said his truck mode had to be extremely special too? I'd even argue that the more he looks like normal trucks, the better his disguise.
Besides that, let's think about Prime and his alt mode through the years:
G1: cab-overs were very standard back then, so in actuality, G1 Prime at the time was a boring truck only accented by transforming and being 2 colors separated by halves of the truck mode.
G2: cab-over was the same. His Laser body proceeded to start to update his alt mode to the times as that is when the long nose trucks started really taking over (tanker trailer was a bit more unique though), and his Hero body was a pretty special alt, it didn't really look like much else. They all kept some degree of chest design, but everything else changed around the chest, and it made for 3 distinct but cool Primes.
RiD2001: I am not aware as to how standard his fire truck alt mode is internationally, but him as a firetruck was a nice fresh change. Which also produced a pretty unique robot mode.
Armada: a stylized long-nose was a cool look, and he kept the grill on the torso though lost the windows, so a departure, but I would argue Armada Prime might be one of the more fun Primes for this, and his long nose truck mode helped add more muscle to him.
Energon: cab over with trailer, pretty close to G1, but had extra gimmicks to help make him more special, especially with his stylized trailer and drones. And also the fact that he was a chunky lad.
Cybertron: take my RiD2001, Armada, and Energon comments, combine them, you got this guy.
Animated: extremely stylized and distinct. He really can't compare to anyone else.
Movie 1-3: pretty standard truck base, but the paint scheme helped set him apart from pretty much all other Primes.
Movie 4-5: completely unique truck that gave us a very unique robot.
Bee movie/RotB: Steampunk G1 (of a sorts) and RotB adds the push bar and such, adds muscle to him.
Prime: similar to movie 1-3 but without the paint. Though it also had the curvy sleeper section, which is somewhat common, but for a Prime it is unique. Beast hunters was utterly unique once again.
RiD2015: full on truck and trailer in corporated, and very angular too
Cyberverse: G1-y, but curvy, in an era where flat-nosed trucks have almost disappeared.
Earthspark: long-nose but more pug-nosed, which itself is a rare look for a truck.
So overall, Prime's alt modes almost all have some way to stand out from the rest in the era they are in. I would argue G1 Prime, Maybe RiD2001 and Laser Prime, and Prime Prime's first body are the only ones that actually sort of blend into their respective time frames, but even then Laser and RiD2001 are unique enough from most other Primes to still have some degree of differentiality.
And in terms of alt modes, Cyberverse is basically a perfect modern reimagining of G1 Prime's robot and alt mode, and that worked for that show. Earthspark for instance re-invented that while keeping him the same colors, the same robot mode components in the same spots, but still being a fresh reimagination.
That is what is needed.
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